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Kikimyste

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I have a 2025 civic sport touring hybrid that I purchased on 11/19 (just shy of two weeks ago). Since then I am already going to have to fill up a second time.

it says my average fuel is 44.4mpg but I have only driven 350 miles on the second full tank.

I have also noticed it sometimes takes quite awhile for ev to kick in even in instances when i have full charge and drive steady at 55mph.

i live in California, do mostly city driving with two trips on the highway at 75mph top speed for only 60 miles round trip. I also have been very conscious of my foot, making a concerted effort to drive steady and brake even.

I can clearly tell the readings are off but even if they were accurate id be averaging well under 40mpg which is no better than my 2007 corolla.

just need to know if im overly concerned and if possible, any explanation why filling up a few times increases mileage.

this is mt first new car and first hybrid so i am very inexperienced.
 

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#2 ·
I am getting 53 mpg on my current tank with just over 2k miles on my car. I live in flat and warm Tucson and I have about a 60/40 mix of city to highway. When I visit Northern Cali each summer, I get less mileage (in any car) in that environment. The mileage will improve some by the 3rd or 4th tank of fuel.
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
azgman9 said:
I am getting 53 mpg on my current tank with just over 2k miles on my car. I live in flat and warm Tucson and I have about a 60/40 mix of city to highway. When I visit Northern Cali each summer, I get less mileage (in any car) in that environment. The mileage will improve some by the 3rd or 4th tank of fuel.
Click to expand...
Thank you for your reply!!
 
#4 ·
We have the '25 Civic Hybrid Sports Touring version and live on the Monterey Peninsula in CA. We have quite a few hills in this area, which range from sea level to about 700 feet in just a few mile radius and goes up to as high as about 1300 feet within say a 12 mile radius. We do not live in the flatlands like azgman9 nor is the temperature quite as mild.

After about 2500 miles of use and recording all the fuel usage and doing the simple arithmetic to arrive at our fuel economy we have data and can draw some conclusions. And some other observations as the weather has gotten a little colder on cold starts and warm up times longer...these affect the ability of the car to engage the EV mode.

Here are the conclusions:

1. Cold morning starts [that's like maybe 42-45F] immediately engages the gas motor and will
remain on for about 8-10 minutes. This is case even going downhill or in the flatter areas and with
the EV battery at full or near full levels from start. Hurts fuels economy badly...say in low 30s MPG for
this start-up period. The car's interior does get comfortable pretty quickly, so heater set at 72. No seat heaters being used, BTW.

2. Never have had better than about 46MPG and that was starting in Yosemite at about 7000 feet and
driving back home, lots of downhill and with some headwinds, about 200+ miles.

3. Forget about getting even 40MPG on the flatlands if going much over 70MPG [Not talking about
much over and no, not 85MPH].

4. Best model for fuel economy is back roads going 60MPH and under. Even going up to elevations
of ~2500 feet and back down again, can and have gotten 43+ MPG for such a stretch.

5. The calculated fuel economy is very close to the car's indicated economy....like actual is maybe
1 MPG lower than indicated [not bad].

6. Yes, I've checked the tire pressures using digital gauges [factory settings 35 Front/33Rear].

7. My expectations are set for never getting [under our regular use style] anything over about 40-42 MPG, short of long trips at elevation on 55-60 MPH roads or some test protocol driving style.

8. So, I have no doubt that going particularly middle speeds [50-60 or so MPH] in the flatlands, some of these cars might get the MFG's rated fuel consumption, but that isn't the case with our use and location.
Our 2010 VW TDI Jetta did better than this by a few MPG. Road trips at 70+ would yield 45-50 MPG,
again, short of horrific headwinds.

Other than slightly disappointing fuel economy, this Civic is a very wonderful car overall.
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
FoggyDaze said:
We have the '25 Civic Hybrid Sports Touring version and live on the Monterey Peninsula in CA. We have quite a few hills in this area, which range from sea level to about 700 feet in just a few mile radius and goes up to as high as about 1300 feet within say a 12 mile radius. We do not live in the flatlands like azgman9 nor is the temperature quite as mild.

After about 2500 miles of use and recording all the fuel usage and doing the simple arithmetic to arrive at our fuel economy we have data and can draw some conclusions. And some other observations as the weather has gotten a little colder on cold starts and warm up times longer...these affect the ability of the car to engage the EV mode.

Here are the conclusions:

1. Cold morning starts [that's like maybe 42-45F] immediately engages the gas motor and will
remain on for about 8-10 minutes. This is case even going downhill or in the flatter areas and with
the EV battery at full or near full levels from start. Hurts fuels economy badly...say in low 30s MPG for
this start-up period. The car's interior does get comfortable pretty quickly, so heater set at 72. No seat heaters being used, BTW.

2. Never have had better than about 46MPG and that was starting in Yosemite at about 7000 feet and
driving back home, lots of downhill and with some headwinds, about 200+ miles.

3. Forget about getting even 40MPG on the flatlands if going much over 70MPG [Not talking about
much over and no, not 85MPH].

4. Best model for fuel economy is back roads going 60MPH and under. Even going up to elevations
of ~2500 feet and back down again, can and have gotten 43+ MPG for such a stretch.

5. The calculated fuel economy is very close to the car's indicated economy....like actual is maybe
1 MPG lower than indicated [not bad].

6. Yes, I've checked the tire pressures using digital gauges [factory settings 35 Front/33Rear].

7. My expectations are set for never getting [under our regular use style] anything over about 40-42 MPG, short of long trips at elevation on 55-60 MPH roads or some test protocol driving style.

8. So, I have no doubt that going particularly middle speeds [50-60 or so MPH] in the flatlands, some of these cars might get the MFG's rated fuel consumption, but that isn't the case with our use and location.
Our 2010 VW TDI Jetta did better than this by a few MPG. Road trips at 70+ would yield 45-50 MPG,
again, short of horrific headwinds.

Other than slightly disappointing fuel economy, this Civic is a very wonderful car overall.
Click to expand...
Legendary and thorough reply thanks so much! Ive had the same issue with cold starts and am glad to hear its normal.

just filled up and found that i only used 8.4 gallons so with my math i ended with about 41mpg on the last tank which is an improvement.

really really appreciate your insight
 
#6 ·
azgman9 said:
I am getting 53 mpg on my current tank with just over 2k miles on my car. I live in flat and warm Tucson and I have about a 60/40 mix of city to highway. When I visit Northern Cali each summer, I get less mileage (in any car) in that environment. The mileage will improve some by the 3rd or 4th tank of fuel.
Click to expand...
Nice observations!
 
#7 ·
There are now at least 3 threads about fuel economy on the '25 Hybrid Civics, just noting. Beyond the cold weather start-up/warm up and need for the ICE motor to get hot enough for emission compliance,
I'm now wondering about how much of an effect that the fuel blends make on this 2L Atkinson cycle
motor. So, if you're one of the folks having sub-40MPG performance and not a complete animal driving this little car like you just stole it, have you tried a non-alcohol gasoline and compared it against the common 10%-15% alcohol fuel blend WRT fuel economy? For me, I have no access to gasoline that
hasn't been doped with alcohol for the California market. Secondary question, can anyone give
a data driven answer on regular gas vs. premium on fuel economy on this non-boosted motor?
I haven't tried that latter experiment, but could, just for the heck of it. I've been using only 89 R+M/2 octane Costco so far. No knocking with this stuff, car seems happy, but fuel economy is nowhere
near 45+ MPG. Getting a nominal maybe 38-40 MPG, most tanks. See previous note from me a couple of posts above this one for background.
 
#9 ·
I use only Costco regular. I think driving conditions and throttle management are the greatest influences on fuel usage. Without trying very hard I am getting 50+Mpg, so it is possible under the right conditions and it is impossible under the wrong conditions!
 
#10 ·
Some quick thoughts:

1) Winter gas blends are always less fuel efficient than summer blends, so any hybrid will see lower MPGs in winter
2) Your car is new and is still breaking in. People report increasingly better gas mileage in the 1.5T engines with time (I know you have the 2.0). Some people only get posted MPGs after 2,000 miles once the engine heat cycles enough.
3) Car manufacturers have engine warmup procedures that prioritize warming up the engine as quickly as possible at the cost of burning gas to lower emissions in the long run. It is counterintuitive, but burning gas inefficiently when the cats and engine are cold to get the engine up to operating temps as quickly as possible lowers overall emissions because it maximizes the time when the engine pollutes least (when it is warm). This might be what is happening with your EV not turning on until later in your trips: Honda programmed its engines to get up to temp before using EV to help with overall emissions (and decreasing your MPGs in the short run)
4) The gas engine is running and powering the wheels when your Honda Hybrid is at steady state high speeds, so with winter gas, you'll be getting worse economy overall. Hybrids get great MPGs in the city, not so much difference in highway speed driving.
 
Discussion starter · #11 ·
chopsuey34 said:
Some quick thoughts:

1) Winter gas blends are always less fuel efficient than summer blends, so any hybrid will see lower MPGs in winter
2) Your car is new and is still breaking in. People report increasingly better gas mileage in the 1.5T engines with time (I know you have the 2.0). Some people only get posted MPGs after 2,000 miles once the engine heat cycles enough.
3) Car manufacturers have engine warmup procedures that prioritize warming up the engine as quickly as possible at the cost of burning gas to lower emissions in the long run. It is counterintuitive, but burning gas inefficiently when the cats and engine are cold to get the engine up to operating temps as quickly as possible lowers overall emissions because it maximizes the time when the engine pollutes least (when it is warm). This might be what is happening with your EV not turning on until later in your trips: Honda programmed its engines to get up to temp before using EV to help with overall emissions (and decreasing your MPGs in the short run)
4) The gas engine is running and powering the wheels when your Honda Hybrid is at steady state high speeds, so with winter gas, you'll be getting worse economy overall. Hybrids get great MPGs in the city, not so much difference in highway speed driving.
Click to expand...
Definitely noticing all of these points as im driving it and getting familiar with how it works. Thanks so much for this response. I really appreciate all of the insight, definitely making me feel more informed and less anxious about the purchase.
 
#12 ·
azgman9 said:
I am getting 53 mpg on my current tank with just over 2k miles on my car. I live in flat and warm Tucson and I have about a 60/40 mix of city to highway. When I visit Northern Cali each summer, I get less mileage (in any car) in that environment. The mileage will improve some by the 3rd or 4th tank of fuel.
Click to expand...
do you have a source that? everything i've read says that over time MPG does not improve over time for hybrids, only ICE.
 
#13 · (Edited)
I have had my '25 Civic Hybrid Sports Touring Hatch for around ~2000 miles, since late October. I drive smoothly and mostly stay in 'Normal' drive mode. Driving so far has been with 25f-50f outside temperature and climate controls set to Auto at 73f-75f. Overall average so far is around 41mpg.

Most of my driving is commuting to/from work, 70% highway with ACC set to 74mph most of the time and 30% off highway on mostly 55mph roads with a few traffic lights mixed in. Car is garaged before trip to work and sits outside at work in 25-50f temp before drive home. I get around ~37-39mpg most of the time for the commuting travel depending on temperatures and driving conditions. I have not found a big difference in mpg between garage temp and outside temp when starting car from 'cold', but I do usually get better mpg if the engine is already/close to temp from a previous trip.

On a recent road trip with outside temps of 30f-43f and 90% highway driving I got ~39mpg over 550 miles.

So far I have found it pretty much impossible to get over 40mpg for steady state highway driving, at least in these kinds of temperatures. It is a little frustrating that when cruising on the highway the system seems to continuously charge battery to about ~50% and then run on EV mode until ~25% (all of about 10 seconds when going highway speed on flat) which seems to make negligible difference to mpg, yet uses many partial charge/discharge cycles, which surely cant be all that good for the life of the battery?

City driving it does much better and getting 45-50+mpg is common/easy. Highest single trip average I have seen was 65mpg for an 8 mile journey where I probably never got over 45mph and it included multiple traffic lights, it was around 45f outside, but the engine was already warm from previous driving.

I will be interested to see after winter when temps warm up, if the mpg improves, or how the AC in summer temps will affect mpg, but I think the highway mpg is likely to stay similar.

Overall I am between meh and happy with the mpg, as i think the 50mpg city rating is certainly achievable, but I do wish it got closer to the highway rating of 45mpg. With the driving I have done so far, I don't think 45mpg will ever be achievable for steady state highway driving over 65mpg.

My impression of the car overall though is great. Comfortable, stylish, great usable interior, rides well, handles well, roomy.
 
#14 ·
1000FC said:
do you have a source that? everything i've read says that over time MPG does not improve over time for hybrids, only ICE.
Click to expand...
We have empirical data from a number of owners that the fuel mileage has improved with some break-in miles.
 
#15 ·
azgman9 said:
We have empirical data from a number of owners that the fuel mileage has improved with some break-in miles.
Click to expand...
we don't have that much data, i've been compiling the data posted in the other thread, for my entries, I used the date on my fuel log:
Image


so we have 4 users with multiple data points that we can use.
of those 1 remained the same, 2 increased by a total of 7mpg, 1 reduced by a total of ~7mpg

we also have the factor that in many areas temps are starting to drop, and people are adjusting they're driving styles slightly as they go.

what we don't have, is proof of:
1) gas MPG increases/decreases after the break in period
2) what the break in period for MPG is, the manual only states the break in period for the engine and powertrain (600 miles) and brake pads and rotors (200 miles)
 
#17 ·
My figure is taken from the Trip B meter that has never been reset since I purchased the car which now has 6200 miles total and it is reading 48.8 so it went down 0.1 mpg with the onset of winter. Note that a trip meter average with a total of over 6,000 miles will not swing or vary wildly day to day, it's a very stable reading so if winter is having a large effect it will take a few weeks for it to show up. Also I'm in California, near the coast, so when I say "winter" It's not anything like what many of you are experiencing.
 
#18 ·
If anyone who has posted their MPG, knows what milage they were at when they posted I can add that info in. I have it for mine only because I track my fuel using a free app (fuelio) Ive added the 2 MPG postings from this thread, azggman9's 53mpg on 12/2 (which is the same mpg reported on 10/19) and kikimystre's 44.4 on 12/2 to my sheet
 
#20 ·
My trip B mileage is 2435 (never reset) and shows 51.6 mpg. This reflects the lower mpg I got in the first 1000 miles. It is also a bit colder here now so the engine is running more to create cabin heat but that might be off set with the decrease in AC use. (which is significant in the summer)
 
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